Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby nature » Mon Jun 23, 2014 3:06 am

Ramblinman wrote:If you believe that society should change its attitude about nudity, the body God gave us to live in while we walk this earth, or perhaps even the topic of naturism, someone should say something to start the process. It doesn't have to be you, but it should be someone or the problem remains for another generation to suffer through.

If you find yourself up against a pastor, deacons and an entire congregation who is convinced that the body is cursed by God and can never under any circumstances be seen, I can't imagine the harm such an attitude would have on my children as they go to church to learn about the things of God. One has to wonder if there are other churches less hostile to God's creation.


I hear you Rambinman and I should not make excuses. However social environment is still a concept I'm getting to grips with. Never have I been taught that home or social nudity is acceptable. My wife and I are still getting used to the whole home nudity (from my part being nude 99% of the time).

We have searched a while trying to find answers and I have not even tried to approach my pastor or elders/deacons for their opinion. I'm actually to scared to try at this moment as I don't know what their response will be.

One thing I can say is that I am looking at the CNC. and at the moment I like what I have already seen. It's actually funny as we had a missionary visiting us at Church on Sunday, encouraging us to fulfill the great commission.One of the pages of CNC the second paragraph talks about the same verse and encourages us as naturist that the resort is our Jerusalem where to the church it is their end of the world.

Is that a sign?????? I dunno but am in the process of learning/studying and figuring out for myself what we as a family should be doing with regards to home and social nudity.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby jasenj1 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:49 am

Ramblinman wrote:If you believe that society should change its attitude about nudity, the body God gave us to live in while we walk this earth, or perhaps even the topic of naturism, someone should say something to start the process. It doesn't have to be you, but it should be someone or the problem remains for another generation to suffer through.

I hear you Ramblinman. If I were single I would be far more willing to put myself out there. However, once you are married and have a wife and children to consider, being vocal about naturism requires far more discernment & caution. I think that's part of Paul's wish that everyone could be single like him - you have far fewer obligations here on Earth.

And there is a difference between telling people you run around naked, and being a bit open with nudity within your family & teaching your children that the body is not bad. And, if situations arise where nudity would be reasonably socially acceptable (say in a locker room, or sauna, or steam room) being "the naked guy".

I believe naturism is Good. And I believe the Church has had a sinful attitude toward the human body for a long time. But speaking out against that attitude is an easy way to get kicked out of a church - I know, I have been. One must weigh all the positive things about being connected to a local church against the damage that could be done by being kicked out.

It's a tough situation to be in. Just this Sunday my pastor made some disparaging remarks about nudity in his sermon. I had to cringe a little. If it weren't such a good church in so many other respects, and we weren't so plugged in ministerially and socially, I'd consider moving on. But as the saying goes, "If you find the perfect church, don't join, you'll ruin it."

- Jasen.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby jasenj1 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:01 am

nature wrote:I hear you Rambinman and I should not make excuses. However social environment is still a concept I'm getting to grips with. Never have I been taught that home or social nudity is acceptable. My wife and I are still getting used to the whole home nudity (from my part being nude 99% of the time).

Why? Why do you feel compelled to be nude at home? What benefit are you, your wife, and your children getting from you walking around the house naked all the time?

I understand the principle that the body is not something to be ashamed of, and that exposure to nudity is/can be a positive influence, and all the other naturist talking-points. But as the husband and father you have an obligation and responsibility to your family first. (Or God first, family second, yourself last.) Are your children taught body acceptance any more with you being naked all the time vs having an open door policy when showering & changing clothes? Are your kids old enough to sit down and explain body image issues with?

And if your wife is not also participating & supportive, does that set up tension in the home that is detrimental?

I would advise caution in pushing the issue too far, too fast.

- Jasen.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby nature » Mon Jun 23, 2014 7:49 am

jasenj1 wrote:Why? Why do you feel compelled to be nude at home? What benefit are you, your wife, and your children getting from you walking around the house naked all the time?

I understand the principle that the body is not something to be ashamed of, and that exposure to nudity is/can be a positive influence, and all the other naturist talking-points. But as the husband and father you have an obligation and responsibility to your family first. (Or God first, family second, yourself last.) Are your children taught body acceptance any more with you being naked all the time vs having an open door policy when showering & changing clothes? Are your kids old enough to sit down and explain body image issues with?

And if your wife is not also participating & supportive, does that set up tension in the home that is detrimental?

I would advise caution in pushing the issue too far, too fast.

- Jasen.


My wife and I have debated this for a longtime. We feel that both kids should not have to be in a situation where they feel embarrassed or ashamed of their bodies. As I feel so comfortable within myself it was decided that I could go nude all the time. Therefore there is no tension in the house between my wife and I.

I have already been able to talk to my son about my sexual abuse experience and about the changes that happens to our bodies as we get older. This talk all took place due to a conversation he had with me over the weekend due to me being in the nude.

So I have put God first daily in my life, with the care and concerns of my family second and then my needs and wants. And through this my wife and I believe that what I am doing is the right thing!
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Ramblinman » Mon Jun 23, 2014 8:35 am

nature wrote:My wife and I have debated this for a longtime. We feel that both kids should not have to be in a situation where they feel embarrassed or ashamed of their bodies. As I feel so comfortable within myself it was decided that I could go nude all the time. Therefore there is no tension in the house between my wife and I.

I have already been able to talk to my son about my sexual abuse experience and about the changes that happens to our bodies as we get older. This talk all took place due to a conversation he had with me over the weekend due to me being in the nude.

So I have put God first daily in my life, with the care and concerns of my family second and then my needs and wants. And through this my wife and I believe that what I am doing is the right thing!


nature, I am not sure how you would judge ahead of time whether your children would be ashamed of their bodies in one setting or another. If they are the only clothed children at a naturist camp, they might feel slightly embarrassed to be wearing clothes, at least feel that they were missing out on the freedom and fun. But we try our best to make the boys feel accepted no matter whether they are nude or in shorts. The grown men set the example of nudity and this example is not lost on the boys. Girls tend to be more confident in this locale, sunning and swimming nude. Our club has a mix of lifetime nudists and families that are new to it, so initial reactions vary, but I think all benefit from the experience.

There is the idea of encouraging people to push their boundaries. We who are mentors only encourage, it is up to the individual to accept a challenge to greater freedom and self-confidence.

Dad was very pleased when I finally joined him in the sauna without clothes.
I have Finnish heritage on my paternal side and historically, nudity in the family sauna is not questioned.
In some families men and boys have one time for nudity, Mom and girls another, but in many families, the entire family is nude and friends of the family are welcome to participate as well. In rural areas or your summer home, you would cool off between sessions by jumping in the lake or rolling in the snow depending on the season, but in a natural setting, you are not expected to wear clothes when you do this. Sauna is like the family chapel, a sacred place of peace and communion with nature and God. I know that in some countries immoral behavior and hard drinking go on, but that is not our tradition, bad behavior in the sauna is the antithesis of sauna culture.

My mother was not naked around the house like Dad, but she always encouraged us to be confident in our bodies. She would say things such as, "Don't worry, everyone knows what boys look like".

In summers, church camp often had gang showers and as kids we would play naked until the call for breakfast. As teens and college age, we showered together, sometimes even the pastor joined us, no one wearing a stitch. It was easier than school nudity, we were all friends and brothers in the Lord at church camp, no worries about bullying or unfair comparisons. On one occasion, I was teased for starting to develop a little sooner than other boys, but the counselor put a stop to that right away and demanded an apology from the offender. The boy gave his word and shook my hand. It helped that the counselor was a hairy man, tall and ex-marine corp. No one dared talk back to him.
If my confidence wavered, it returned full-force, not because I hid behind clothes, but because I had my father and church leaders to stand behind me and speak encouraging words to me.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby JimShedd112 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 8:50 am

Nature, it does seem things are moving in the right reaction within your family. I wish I had such an understanding and supportive wife. My daughter knows I'm a nudist and, in fact, spent a couple of evenings fully nude with me herself, without my wife's knowledge but has decided it's not for her. I'm not allowed to walk around the house or back yard nude but do sleep fully nude, often with the granddaughter sleeping between my wife and I with nothing said.

Reference the church situation I'm not a church goer and haven't been for many years but isn't it rather hypocritical of them to ostracize you for sinning (going nude)? After all, aren't they supposed to be concerned about saving you from eternal hell? Just a though.

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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Ramblinman » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:04 am

JimShedd112 wrote:Nature, it does seem things are moving in the right reaction within your family. I wish I had such an understanding and supportive wife. My daughter knows I'm a nudist and, in fact, spent a couple of evenings fully nude with me herself, without my wife's knowledge but has decided it's not for her. I'm not allowed to walk around the house or back yard nude but do sleep fully nude, often with the granddaughter sleeping between my wife and I with nothing said.

Reference the church situation I'm not a church goer and haven't been for many years but isn't it rather hypocritical of them to ostracize you for sinning (going nude)? After all, aren't they supposed to be concerned about saving you from eternal hell? Just a though.

Jim Shedd


Jim, your daughter understands the concept you are now living by and we shouldn't underestimate the power of an idea, even if she is not (for now) putting it into action, but I am glad she tried it.

One way of looking at church is as a hospital for the soul. What hospital would turn away a patient?
I guess the opponents of naturism would argue that the "patient" is refusing their remedy (wearing clothes all the time and feeling deep shame about the body God gave us), but then again, "Never be seen naked" is not medically necessary so to speak, but a fable, an urban legend that contradicts good practice.

As you have seen from our discussions, Christian history and scripture are on the side of a better attitude about the body, better attitude about nudity. One man against a church house full of uneducated and prejudiced people can still be drowned out, but not all churches are like this.

The love of God and an open mind are not mutually exclusive concepts.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby natman » Mon Jun 23, 2014 4:02 pm

Nature,

I also recommend that you proceed with caution and very much prayer. At the same time, I am a bit envious of you for being so proactive in this area. We (my ex-wife and myself, and then my current wife) raised our kids not to be ashamed of their bodies and that being nude around the house was a matter of comfort and practicality for each of us. In the case of all except my current wife's oldest son, who was already 13 and involved in online porn with his friends when I met her, the kids have all done well in the body-image area. My wife's oldest son has had the hardest time, but even he has no problem coming in and talking to us while we are showering or changing.

I think that you and your family have a LOT to gain by having a Godly attitude about the nude human body, and the best time to instill it is when the kids are young. Then when (not if) then encounter pornography or sexual temptations, they will know for themselves that is NOT how it is supposed to be.
SON-cerely,
Nathan Powers

Get exposed to the sun, and get exposed to the Son.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Petros » Mon Jun 23, 2014 6:02 pm

"Why? Why do you feel compelled to be nude at home? What benefit are you, your wife, and your children getting from you walking around the house naked all the time?"

"Compelled"?

Speaking of course solamente for meself - for whom else can I ? - I am not compelled to be nude - though I will when I et the chance and will wish I had more. Not compelled to read - though I tend to have three books in process at any one time. Not compelled to sit on the porch of a warm but breezy morning or evening - but I could wish there were more of them.

As for the others - all of us have our would if we could but don't have to areas, and we balance out our needs and avoidances.

AND OF COURSE - except on cold days and when the garment squad raids the place, there is the question, what benefit do we get prancing around in clothes all the time?
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Bare_Truth » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:43 pm

nature wrote:........
I have already been able to talk to my son about my sexual abuse experience and about the changes that happens to our bodies as we get older. This talk all took place due to a conversation he had with me over the weekend due to me being in the nude. .......
Well Done, Nature!
On a single topic of communication with your son:
-- You have been able to open up to him and help him to understand where you are coming from
-- You have been able to open the door to information that our children need to be aware of
-- You have been able to share intimate information on a father-son basis that will help build a trusting relationship that strengthen communication greatly.
-- You have shown him that there are painful experiences in life but there are ways to get through them and overcome them.
Not everyone can pull all of those off, let alone 4 at once. Would that all dads could do that sort of thing!
I never met anyone that I could not learn something from.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby jasenj1 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:57 am

Petros wrote:Speaking of course solamente for meself - for whom else can I ? - I am not compelled to be nude - though I will when I et the chance and will wish I had more. Not compelled to read - though I tend to have three books in process at any one time. Not compelled to sit on the porch of a warm but breezy morning or evening - but I could wish there were more of them.

As for the others - all of us have our would if we could but don't have to areas, and we balance out our needs and avoidances.

AND OF COURSE - except on cold days and when the garment squad raids the place, there is the question, what benefit do we get prancing around in clothes all the time?


Well written. Points taken.

My main points were that if being nude around the house was a cause of marital strife, raised concerns about legal entanglements, and increased the risk of problems at church, then it probably ought to be restricted. Those are the reasons I'm not nude at home as much as I'd like. That doesn't mean I'm never nude at home, that I don't carve out some times to enjoy nudity - especially when the family is out.

As you said, balance out our needs/desires and avoidances. From his other thread, it sounds like nature has started some good body positive patterns in his home. Full-time nudity at home might just work out for him.
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Petros » Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:57 am

Yes - therre must be balance, and it has to bear in mind the two basic com mendments, which do NOT include "If it feels good do it"

I would be happy indeed to have a family that tolerated if it could not embrace nude time. As it is, I have a drive [not, thank God, a compulsion, which would not be healthy] to be clothesfree when appropriate - and a higher imperative to keep Herself comfortable, which means at present keeping bare skin out of her awareness. And we do well.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Ramblinman » Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:21 am

Both my parents believed the following (and Dad put it more into practice, Mom more vocal about it. I learned from both of them:

And the weaver said, "Speak to us of Clothes." And he answered: Your clothes conceal much of your beauty, yet they hide not the unbeautiful. And though you seek in garments the freedom of privacy you may find in them a harness and a chain. Would that you could meet the sun and the wind with more of your skin and less of your raiment, For the breath of life is in the sunlight and the hand of life is in the wind. Some of you say, "It is the north wind who has woven the clothes to wear." But shame was his loom, and the softening of the sinews was his thread. And when his work was done he laughed in the forest. Forget not that modesty is for a shield against the eye of the unclean. And when the unclean shall be no more, what were modesty but a fetter and a fouling of the mind? And forget not that the earth delights to feel your bare feet and the winds long to play with your hair. - Kahlil Gibran: The Prophet

And germane to this conversation as well:

Then Almitra spoke again and said, "And what of Marriage, master?" And he answered saying: You were born together, and together you shall be forevermore. You shall be together when white wings of death scatter your days. Aye, you shall be together even in the silent memory of God. But let there be spaces in your togetherness, And let the winds of the heavens dance between you. Love one another but make not a bond of love: Let it rather be a moving sea between the shores of your souls. Fill each other's cup but drink not from one cup. Give one another of your bread but eat not from the same loaf. Sing and dance together and be joyous, but let each one of you be alone, Even as the strings of a lute are alone though they quiver with the same music. Give your hearts, but not into each other's keeping. For only the hand of Life can contain your hearts. And stand together, yet not too near together: For the pillars of the temple stand apart, And the oak tree and the cypress grow not in each other's shadow. - Kahlil Gibran: The Prophet

These two essays served them well for all the years they married (until death parted them).
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Petros » Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:37 am

I should look into Gibran. He was the wrong time and consituency for me in his heyday, and one tends to forget him.
The truth, the stark naked truth, the truth without so much as a loincloth on, should surely be the investigator's sole aim - Basil Chamberlain
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Re: Who knows you practice Naturism and do you tell?

Postby Ramblinman » Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:22 pm

jasenj1 wrote:...My main points were that if being nude around the house was a cause of marital strife,

Wearing clothes would probably not stop the strife with a contentious woman (or man). She'd find something else to demand that you conform to.
jasenj1 wrote:...raised concerns about legal entanglements,

I think we have pretty much addressed those concerns as baseless on most counts and manageable in the few things that might come up. Prudes don't like this, but our beliefs are protected by the courts, just as any religion should be.

jasenj1 wrote: and increased the risk of problems at church,

I am of the mind that churches where an honest difference of opinion is not tolerated are bringing a terrible message to the world and I won't give a penny to such a place. Do we really want to give our blessing to a "ministry" that calls God a pornographer? (after all he created naked humans and more naked babies are born every day).
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